[Annelies]

OK then so facts don't exist. Thank you.

That's was the whole point I was making.

[pbanj]

not every one believes in science, just as not every one believes in religion. facts are facts, opinions are opinions, and theories are theories. the three are different just as tey share some of the same qualities just like religion and science do

[Alexerer]

major question asked over the ages "Is there a god?" religion tries to answer it and science tries to prove/disapprove it. Am I right? That is why i don't think science is a religion.

[KillerBug]

Originally Posted by Annelies OK then so facts don't exist. Thank you. That's was the whole point I was making.

You are more than welcome on that.

Facts don't exist...but you do have to live life, and you can't do it entirely based on an ancient book; you can't even do it based on a book written before the invention of digital computers. The theories of science can never be proven, but without them, we would be in the dark ages.

Maybe there is a god, but then what one? It is impossible to prove; it might be some god not in any religion; maybe our universe is just a high-school science fair entry for some galactic being, and we are now in a galactic landfill because he lost to some better entry...I can't disprove that. I can't even prove that my keyboard makes electrical signals that are converted to text as I type this...but it is the best theory I have at the moment.

Oh...one other thing, I actually do believe in a god...I met a part of it once. But I am the only one who saw it, so even I cannot be certain...maybe I just had some bad bread or something.

[Alexerer]

^^ mostly I just think "It just works, dont explain because someone found it out by accident" for technology
also a good quote that I think applies to science and all humans----> “Learning is never cumulative, it is a movement of knowing which has no beginning and no end.” --Bruce Lee

[Mackdanny]

"facts don't exist"


Lol, believe it or not that was the topic one day in college WRITING class, lol. Its like the color red, I see it, my brother sees it, we believe in red.... But what if you're colorblind to red? If you're color blind to red you know it exists only because I said it does... But you've never seen it before, therefore it must not exist. Another reason of facts don't exist, controversially can be related to the Casey Anthony Trial. Despite all the "facts" she was found not guilty. On that note I'm going to end said example before it becomes out of hand -.-

[KillerBug]

Originally Posted by Mackdanny "facts don't exist" Lol, believe it or not that was the topic one day in college WRITING class, lol. Its like the color red, I see it, my brother sees it, we believe in red.... But what if you're colorblind to red? If you're color blind to red you know it exists only because I said it does... But you've never seen it before, therefore it must not exist. Another reason of facts don't exist, controversially can be related to the Casey Anthony Trial. Despite all the "facts" she was found not guilty. On that note I'm going to end said example before it becomes out of hand -.-

Red is just an arbitrary term people apply to certain wavelengths of light. You might see red, I might see dark pink, or maybe light purple.

Alexerer - Some knowledge is cumulative. The knowledge of the process of making an i7 CPU is built upon decades of previous knowledge going way back to vacuum tubes. Invention, true invention that is, is not always cumulative...but implementation of invention almost always relies on existing technologies...unless you are inventing Karate moves or something. Also, the keyboard was not an accident...it was built upon existing technologies and even stole the layout from typewriters.

[Alexerer]

^^ as i said before I am usually wrong, plus Bruce Lee isn't 100% rite on everything

[FreePlay]

Originally Posted by Annelies I still say a fact is a widely agreed upon opinion, since we all see things through our own eyes, our own perceptions. A way of regarding, understanding, or interpreting something; a mental impression. To me, the entire Earth could just be a marshmallow. Am I wrong? No. It's the way I perceive the Earth. The way you perceive it may be different, but one thing is sure: Nothing is carved in stone.

Yes, you're wrong. Reality is objective and does not care for your perceptions. Facts are things that are true whether or not you perceive, understand, or believe them. The fact that we don't know a thing doesn't mean it doesn't exist to be known. Learn you some Kant.

Originally Posted by Annelies I reccomend this movie: It's called What The Bleep Do We Know? [IMG]

This movie is a bunch of unmitigated horsesh*t, funded and promoted by a cult that worships a woman who claims to channel the spirit of a warrior from Atlantis.

As for the thread topic... don't even get me started.
************* [ - Post Merged - ] *************
OK, fine, since we've got a postmodernist crapping all over the thread, looks like I should get involved.

Originally Posted by Annelies Couldn't I just say this to you? As long as we all have different perceptions on life, facts don't exist. Man A: The Earth is round. Man B: Well, I see it as a square. Man A: You're wrong! Man B: How am I wrong? Man A: Because it's round. It's a fact. Man B: Well I'm looking at it right now and I see it as a square. Man A: You're a liar. Listen to the facts! Man B: How am I lying? You aren't looking through my eyes. If I see it as a square then it's a square. Man A: Liar! Man B: Explain. Man A: The rest of the world see's it round, so its a fact that its round! Man B: So just because everybody else sees it a certain way automatically makes it a fact? My case.

Your case is stupid. The fact is that the world is round. This is not based upon agreement about anything other than the definition of 'round'. What you see is irrelevant. If you see a thing as something other than what it really is, you're suffering from a flaw of perception. Your reality is not any different because of your broken senses. A thing is what it is and is never anything else. A thing cannot objectively be two different things to two different people; it can only be perceived as such subjectively.

Originally Posted by Annelies Consciously or subconsciously, I think the only reason people think facts exist is because everybody else is in agreement with them. If everybody in the world said oranges were poisonous, then everybody would think so, making it a "fact." Am I lying if I say 10% of the blood that runs through my veins is apple juice because I truly believe it is? Can't prove me wrong because what I see is apple juice. Perception is the most valuable thing in the Universe and is what truly makes a person beautiful. It's something nobody can take away from you. It's what makes you an individual.

All you're doing is redefining the word 'fact' to remove any possible useful meaning from it. If a fact is neither objectively true nor objectively false, it's not ANYTHING anymore.

Originally Posted by Annelies I think we all can remember the Black Death of Europe which took place between 1348 and 1350. Then, it was a fact that they were being punished by God. Now it's a fact that the rats carried the disease. Then later it will be a fact that ?????. Facts are supposed to be undeniable yet they change. Like opinions.

Those were hypotheses, not facts. The facts, which have never changed and CANNOT change because they're factual, are whatever is objectively true about the plague, whether we know what that is or not. (Actually, it's now known that rats weren't the major carriers.)

Originally Posted by Annelies That doesn't make sense because like I said, facts are supposed to be undeniable. Once a fact always a fact. And I refuse to talk about your son because I see what you're trying to do and it's immature. I and a good amount of other people here don't think facts exist and change. I don't see what the problem is.

The problem is that you're in denial of how reality actually works.

Originally Posted by Annelies OK then so facts don't exist. Thank you. That's was the whole point I was making.

He said that science works in theories and not in facts. He did not say facts don't exist.

You are literally arguing that if we don't know a fact with absolute certainty, it does not exist. You may as well be arguing that we're all figments of your imagination.

Allow me to repeat myself: facts are facts whether they're known or not.

This is for you.
Tim Minchin's Storm the Animated Movie - YouTube

[Alexerer]

^^ HULK SMASH
you just gave me something else to skim ;D