[hello345]

Originally Posted by stevorkz Trust me if there wasn't a chance for sony to make loads off of this "indie game developers" game, they would NEVER do this.

Isn't Sony a company that tries to make money, so they can be able to pay all their employees?

Why do you use quote signs around indie game developers by the way? If they are not indie game developers, what are they?

[NTA]

Only in the UK? That's bs >_>

[stevorkz]

Originally Posted by hello345 Isn't Sony a company that tries to make money, so they can be able to pay all their employees? Why do you use quote signs around indie game developers by the way? If they are not indie game developers, what are they?

Exactly...thank you for proving my point. They're nothing but a money leeching corporation and this good guy sony attitude in which they want to help the indie devs isnt fooling anyone. I put it in quotes because indie game developers coming from them is a very nice term for homebrew idiots who have been supporting cfw machines.

My point is they clearly have never been impressed with anyone making homebrew and distributing it amongst people who have cfw on there consoles...until they realized money could be made off of them.

"I really encourage submissions from recent graduates, game incubators and young start-ups to take a shot at this"

Here's my prediction : You've won congratulations! Keep your young and gullible eyes distracted on this "impressive" £25,000 cheque while we write in extremely fine cryptic print on the page you're about to sign, that we own the rights to your game.

Now tell me sony wouldnt do that

[hello345]

Originally Posted by stevorkz Exactly...thank you for proving my point. They're nothing but a money leeching corporation and this good guy sony attitude in which they want to help the indie devs isnt fooling anyone. I put it in quotes because indie game developers coming from them is a very nice term for homebrew idiots who have been supporting cfw machines. My point is they clearly have never been impressed with anyone making homebrew and distributing it amongst people who have cfw on there consoles...until they realized money could be made off of them.

Yeah, it is very uncommon that a company wants to make money. I think Sony is one of the few companies that wants to make money. I'm not sure how the other companies are able to stay in business when their goal is not to make money, but still making new games and hardware, and also paying full salary to their employees.

Seriously though, why is it a complain that a company is trying to make money on a funding project like this? It is simply a business opportunity that is presented. If someone doesn't want any part of it, then that is their own choice. For others, maybe they see this is a good opportunity. It is about gaming business, it isn't about impressing someone on a forum or similar. These funding projects are also a good way to hunt for great talents


Why are you calling people who support cfw with homebrew for idiots?

A lot of indie developers are not depended on cfw machines. Using a PC will give everything that a cfw machine can do, and a lot more. The biggest indie gaming scene is afterall on PC for this reason.


Out of curiousity, how do you expect them to show that their impressed with cfw? It is understandable that companies tries to patch exploits on closed systems. How do you know that they are not impressed with some of the work on cfw? How do you expect them to show this? I actually don't think that Sony hate homebrew, but they hate the exploits being used.

Originally Posted by stevorkz "I really encourage submissions from recent graduates, game incubators and young start-ups to take a shot at this" Here's my prediction : You've won congratulations! Keep your young and gullible eyes distracted on this "impressive" £25,000 cheque while we write in extremely fine cryptic print on the page you're about to sign, that we own the rights to your game. Now tell me sony wouldnt do that

I have no idea what the terms are for this XDEV project, but this is a likely possibility indeed, that is true. This is however very common among publishers, and it is understandable. The publishers are afterall the ones who take all the financial risk by funding and publishing a game. This is not a risk free process, especially with new IPs. That is why the publishers usually want to keep the IP, because they want to secure that (it comes back to business).

The rules for this XDEV project are probably available somewhere, so it shouldn't be cryptic. It should also be widely known by game developers that if you get someone else to publish your game, be prepared to give up the IP. Sony does allow self publishing on PSN by the way, so that is also an opnion (i'm not sure how this process works however).

[stevorkz]

May I ask why you are taking my sony rants so personally? Do you work for them or something? Is that you Maria? Serious question I'm not making fun.

Originally Posted by hello345 Yeah, it is very uncommon that a company wants to make money.

Would you kindly point out where I said it was uncommon? My point there was this is proof that they don't give a damn about the indie guy as long as they can make money off them. If you knew the history of the ps3 scene you would know what I mean. They labelled all ps3 homebrew devs and cfw users as criminals because we want to run our own homebrew code...now all of a sudden they want to host a competition? If they want to make a profit thats super...but then the majority of those profits belong to the indie dev not sony corp, and that's why I have a problem with it.

Originally Posted by hello345 Why are you calling people who support cfw with homebrew for idiots?

I was talking earlier as if I were sony. Trust me, they do not like us.

Originally Posted by hello345 A lot of indie developers are not depended on cfw machines. Using a PC will give everything that a cfw machine can do, and a lot more. The biggest indie gaming scene is afterall on PC for this reason.

Yeah you are right they dont need a cfw machine to code but it doesn't take a wild leap of imagination to realize that alot of them do have a cfw machine in any case to run and enjoy there creations.

Originally Posted by hello345 Out of curiousity, how do you expect them to show that their impressed with cfw? It is understandable that companies tries to patch exploits on closed systems. How do you know that they are not impressed with some of the work on cfw? How do you expect them to show this? I actually don't think that Sony hate homebrew, but they hate the exploits being used.

If they hate the exploits being used that's there own problem. No one designed the ps3 with the exploits to be discovered but sony. Not sure what you mean by 'they hate the exploits'. That's like saying they are impressed with ps2 infinity chips they just don't like the way its installed.

The reason we don't like sony, is because we bought a machine fair and square with them and feel we want to do what we want with it because quite frankly, the machine is ours now. Just like my PC is mine and I mod and do what I want with it, just like my car is mine and I mod and do what I want with it, just like my house is mine and I change and personalize it and do what I want with it. Without choice, what is life? Let people who want to only play games and blu-rays do just that, but for the rest of us who like to mess around give us some choice.

Perhaps they would never admit it, but ya they could be impressed with the fact that a worldwide community cracked there uncrackable system. What they aren't impressed with is the fact that this community is doing things on the ps3 that it wasn't designed to do, and they aren't getting a slice of the action.

If people enjoy there ps3's, that means sony is happy. Because that means they are buying games and content off of SEN. With cfw machines, content is available for absolutely nothing. I'm not only talking about pirated games I'm talking about awesome homebrew apps like showtime. Showtime is one of the reasons why I personally kept on cfw

I do see what you are trying to say though. And it would be wonderful if they helped nurture a successful gaming company into their prime. But knowing sony they'll screw them over

[hello345]

Originally Posted by stevorkz May I ask why you are taking my sony rants so personally? Do you work for them or something? Is that you Maria? Serious question I'm not making fun.

No, why do you think i take it personally? Because i ask questions? You reply with long replies too, so i can ask the same question back to you, why are you taking my questions so personally? Do you work for a competing company?

Sorry, i don't want to have a fighting attitude in this discussion. I'm just trying to have a normal discussion about this subject, nothing more

Originally Posted by stevorkz Would you kindly point out where I said it was uncommon? My point there was this is proof that they don't give a damn about the indie guy as long as they can make money off them. If you knew the history of the ps3 scene you would know what I mean. They labelled all ps3 homebrew devs and cfw users as criminals because we want to run our own homebrew code...now all of a sudden they want to host a competition? If they want to make a profit thats super...but then the majority of those profits belong to the indie dev not sony corp, and that's why I have a problem with it.

You didn't say that it was uncommon, but you wrote it in a way that this is a bad thing, trying to make money of publishing a game. Every company tries to make money, so what you said applies to every company.

That they want to make money for taking the financial risk of publishing a game is natural. If i approach a indie developer and say "i want to publish your games, it will cost me $50,000". And if the developer says "ok, but we want 90% of all the profits from the sales", then the financial risk is much bigger for me.


Where did they label people who want to run homebrew code as criminals? Sony offered official homebrew support for the 3-4 first years of the PS3, with OtherOS. What happened later on is a story on it's own, but they did offer homebrew support to begin with.

I know that cracking systems often leads to piracy, and that is the biggest issue for the game companies. Enabling homebrew often enables piracy as well, that is what they have an issue with. It doesn't really help much that a hacker says that his/hers intention was just to run legit homebrew.

Originally Posted by stevorkz I was talking earlier as if I were sony. Trust me, they do not like us.

I'm not sure, Sony has offered official homebrew support for every system except the PSP. For PS1 it was Net Yaroze. For PS2 it was the Linux Kit. For PS3 it was OtherOS. For Vita it is Playstation Mobile.

OtherOS was the only free and widely available option, but from what i know, hardly anyone used it for making homebrew.

Originally Posted by stevorkz Yeah you are right they dont need a cfw machine to code but it doesn't take a wild leap of imagination to realize that alot of them do have a cfw machine in any case to run and enjoy there creations.

It is possible that they have CFW machines indeed. But i just ment that i can't see how CFW adds anything to what they are able to do. I actually can't think of any game that have been specifically made for CFW. I mostly just see ports or multiplatform things for PC. I'm not complaining about this, not at all, i'm just saying that CFW doesn't add too much to whats possible in indie game developement, at least the way i see it.

Originally Posted by stevorkz If they hate the exploits being used that's there own problem. No one designed the ps3 with the exploits to be discovered but sony. Not sure what you mean by 'they hate the exploits'. That's like saying they are impressed with ps2 infinity chips they just don't like the way its installed.

Sure, its their problem because they are afterall producing the products. But they don't make these exploits on purpose. Exploits are bugs in the code, these are made my mistake. The bugs can allow people to exploit them, and the companies don't like this. Otherwise they wouldn't have kept updating the firmware, patching the bugs/exploits.

If you do a mistake and people try to take advantage of the mistakes you did, then i guess that you wouldn't have like this? That is what i mean with that they hate the exploits.

Originally Posted by stevorkz The reason we don't like sony, is because we bought a machine fair and square with them and feel we want to do what we want with it because quite frankly, the machine is ours now. Just like my PC is mine and I mod and do what I want with it, just like my car is mine and I mod and do what I want with it, just like my house is mine and I change and personalize it and do what I want with it. Without choice, what is life? Let people who want to only play games and blu-rays do just that, but for the rest of us who like to mess around give us some choice.

The hardware is yours, but the software is biggest issue here. Buying a PC, you don't own the rights the the software then.

By the way, about your house and car, there are regulations and laws about what you can do of modifications here (depending a bit on where you live of course), so not everything is allowed on these things either.

PC is also following a different business model. When you buy a PC, the companies make profit on the hardware itself. It isn't that often you see the same thing in the console industry. For example. the PS3 is said to be sold at a loss of $200 for every console at launch.

The console companies makes their biggest share of money from software sales and accessories. That is why they are much more sensitive to piracy.

If consoles were sold with a big profit margin like PC hardware, then maybe we could see more open solutions in the console industry as well. But i don't think that the market will support something like this. The consoles would be much more expencive then.

Originally Posted by stevorkz Perhaps they would never admit it, but ya they could be impressed with the fact that a worldwide community cracked there uncrackable system. What they aren't impressed with is the fact that this community is doing things on the ps3 that it wasn't designed to do, and they aren't getting a slice of the action.

Yeah, the piracy thing is the worse for them. Its understandable that they dont like this. And i agree, they are probably impressed with the skills that many of these hackers have.

Originally Posted by stevorkz If people enjoy there ps3's, that means sony is happy. Because that means they are buying games and content off of SEN. With cfw machines, content is available for absolutely nothing. I'm not only talking about pirated games I'm talking about awesome homebrew apps like showtime. Showtime is one of the reasons why I personally kept on cfw

Yeah, CFW can bring many cool and legit thing to a system indeed, that is true. But the biggest problem with CFW is that it often allows piracy as well. The the problem further on is that there is no system that can differenciate the people who use CFW for legit use only, and the people who use it mostly for piracy. So the companies have to block it for everyone, unfortunately.

Originally Posted by stevorkz I do see what you are trying to say though. And it would be wonderful if they helped nurture a successful gaming company into their prime. But knowing sony they'll screw them over

Who knows, only time will tell

[hello345]

Originally Posted by stevorkz *text*

Sorry for the double post, but i just wanted to say that i wasn't trying to have a fighting attitude in my previous posts if it looked like that from some of my sarcastic comments, sorry about that. I just tried to have a normal discussion. I just wanted to say that

[stevorkz]

@hello345

Lol. No problem dude. Unlike others on this site I respect people that form their own opinion in an intelligent manner and I listen and learn from them. That's why I gave you the like

[SuperDre]

This is not for the PS3, this is for the Playstation Mobile platform, and the SDK has been out already for quite some time.. At the moment this is the only way to create homebrew for the PS-vita..

[GregoryRasputin]

Originally Posted by SuperDre At the moment this is the only way to create homebrew for the PS-vita..

No it isnt
The official PS Vita SDK can make Homebrew too