[destroyersphere]

Originally Posted by Cheesethief I have an issue with this part of the interview. Hackers did achieve linux again on the PS3, but it was just the same as remaining on 3.15. There was no point whatsoever then to hack 3.41/3.55 with that logic. You could have your cake and eat it too on 3.15 if you were a hacker. No, the reason 3.41 and 3.55 were hacked was for homebrew on later firmwares with the goal of bringing back Linux to all future firmwares. Not to just bring it back once and then quit. If you do that, then why do it at all if you could have stuck with 3.15 and had virtually the same outcome? Holding these keys back is akin to holding back Linux on all future firmwares (the original goal of getting Linux back).

My point exactly! Sony taking away otherOS just added fuel to the fire.

[erexx]

Well that was a depressing read... filled with generalizations and judgements...
feel a little sick now... going to go away for awhile...

[Cheesethief]

Originally Posted by destroyersphere My point exactly! Sony taking away otherOS just added fuel to the fire.

The fire apparently went out immediately though, which is something I do not understand.

[destroyersphere]

Originally Posted by baargle People will think I'm an idiot for saying this, but...

Nope, don't think anyone is calling you an idiot. In fact I think most agree with you, including myself.

Despite how brilliant of a hacker Kakaroto is, he really sounds like a prick in this interview, saying all that jazz about hackers having a responsibility to withhold their findings to prevent piracy. Not cool.

[Cheesethief]

Originally Posted by destroyersphere Nope, don't think anyone is calling you an idiot. In fact I think most agree with you, including myself. Despite how brilliant of a hacker Kakaroto is, he really sounds like a prick in this interview, saying all that jazz about hackers having a responsibility to withhold their findings to prevent piracy. Not cool.

I think Kakarotoks missed the lesson about white hat, grey hat, and black hat hackers. There are people with varying beliefs.

[destroyersphere]

Originally Posted by erexx Well that was a depressing read... filled with generalizations and judgements... feel a little sick now... going to go away for awhile...

HAHA! I know right. I used to follow kakaroto's twitter feed like it was my job hoping for a new cfw. This interview made me lose a bit of respect for him.

Seems like Rogero and these anonymous leakers are the new rockstars of the scene after the sad demise of guys like graf, geohot and math. Although, perhaps geohot and math had it coming.

[R3QU13M]

Same Sh*t Different Day.

[baargle]

Originally Posted by destroyersphere Nope, don't think anyone is calling you an idiot. In fact I think most agree with you, including myself. Despite how brilliant of a hacker Kakaroto is, he really sounds like a prick in this interview, saying all that jazz about hackers having a responsibility to withhold their findings to prevent piracy. Not cool.

Cheers, well yeah. The whole problem with bringing the "piracy" thing into hacking is that it just opens up more debate. Obviously the reasoning is to prevent a company losing profits.

The problem with this is that Sony isn't a non profit organization. All companies that are floated on the stock market and have revenues in the billions have exploited the "little man" over the years, they will have inevitably bought out smaller companies technology for far less than it was really worth. They will have abused customers. I don't want to get nasty about it but Sony is one of the worst for this exploitation. They are a company that have since the early 80s, purposefully released products that aren't consumer friendly and sought to establish industry standards based on their patents alone - or if not possible as little patents as possible from other companies.

Betamax, Memory Stick Duo, Memory Stick Pro Duo, MiniDisc, PSVita Memory Cards, (there will inevitably be more but that's just for starters as I'm not clued up on the depths of this). There's nothing wrong with creating standards per se, it should be commended as it moves technology forward, but none of these standards were created in pioneering terms, they were created to exploit - other open standards were perfectly fine at the time. Actually I think you can chuck Mini-DV in there too. Hell, even their compact form factor digital cameras (The NEX models for example) use their own lenses that aren't interchangeable with the Micro Four Thirds standard. - Madness.

Anyway, back to the point. They are a profit making company, a business. No business deserves a free ride, the same dirty tactics they use on a moral level should be fair game to be used against them. When you really think a bit deeper, video games are simply a pastime - they are not a hobby, they bring nothing to the world. We're not talking about "The Red Cross" here, we're talking about business. They make profits - money - your money and seek to make their shareholders money. It's not a cooperative where people genuinely benefit from their work.

It's all about money for Sony, and there's nothing wrong with that - It's business - Same for all companies.

BUT - If that is the case, why are these "hackers" treating Sony almost as if they are a non-profit organization? Showing them the respect they simply don't deserve.

Even as judged as a company, Sony has sued everyone and their dog, sought to exploit industry standards, used shady DRM on music CDs, been a pioneer in corrupting DVDs adding non standard protections to them, the pioneer of CD copy protections (well maybe you could say that was Macrovision, but they were a close 2nd). A Pioneer in DRM for Bluray in the form of Cinavia....Speaking of Bluray, what happened to HD DVD and industry standard that was much more open that....surprise surprise was the competitor to Sony's Bluray.

I'm not getting into HD DVD Vs Bluray debate - That's besides the point.

Sony are a pretty dirty company, so even if you disregard my previous post as incorrect, you still have a company that is well...let's say not exactly a shining example of all that is good in the world.

Then you compare to a company like Microsoft, also a company that isn't perfect - by a long shot with anti-trust suits up to it's rear end. But that's about it in the big picture and it's highly arguable if consumers really have lost out because of that - and not just other companies. I'm not supporting Microsoft - just drawing a comparison.

Remember Bill Gates, the most hated man in the world, not many people know that he's also the most generous a quick google for "Bill Gates philanthropy" brings up a lot of information that will quickly make you feel like quite a horrible person for judging him.

Then there's the suits, there's been very few from Microsoft to my knowledge.

Anyway....this post is a bit of a 2 wrongs make a right, but what the hell Just a bit more insight. It's easy to counter and say if this attitude was taken with all companies, we wouldn't have any business in the world to speak of.

True enough, but if you dig down further again, the very principle of capitalism and business is flawed, if inevitable (I'm not a communist ideologist)....

...And finally mixing the support of capitalism with the ethos of a hacker...

Where the hell did those two become best buddies

...Which kinda is the point of my post on previous page...You know Linux, uhhh it's kinda free. These hackers don't deserve the talking box they've been offered, they aren't working "for the people".

The really ironic thing is that the LV0 keys were released to prevent a company exploiting them for a profit

...Now hold on there, doesn't that sound familiar? "A company exploiting another entity for profit"

So it's fair game to put "BlueDisc" out of business - totally - because you made foolish decision to give the LV0 keys to someone. But it's not ok to release something that could cause a small loss of profits for a multinational conglomerate company. (I do NOT support BlueDisk\TB\Whatever, this is to draw parallels and challenge the moral viewpoints of people in this interview and on a general level of PS3 hackers)

.....Hmmmm....OK. I'll tell you why it's "OK". It's because they were motivated by spite. Of course, what else could it be? All that hard work...now someone's making money...how dare they!? Well mister hacker, how do you think these small companies that foolishly sold out to Sony feel. It was their fault too, do you have sympathy?...

A sod it...I need a coffee and a ciggy....this is starting to sound like something @hellsing9 would write and I've got no excuse as I'm English (just a joke mate)

[Cheesethief]

Originally Posted by baargle Betamax, Memory Stick Duo, Memory Stick Pro Duo, MiniDisc, PSVita Memory Cards, (there will inevitably be more but that's just for starters as I'm not clued up on the depths of this).

You forgot the original Compact Disc (CD), and partially Blu-Ray (they were one of a handful of a companies that developed it).

[libretro]

The image of the hacker is slowly dying as a result of this and in place of a magical aura, we have a corporate shill in effect. This isn't how it's supposed to be.

That is exactly right. This whole 'deriding against piracy' thing is not only disingenuous (and two-faced since we all know who the biggest pirates are 'behind the scenes') - but it's just a ploy used by desperate twenty something unemployed kids thinking by talking that way, they're going to get a job (which is really pathetic). It's also a way of kissing ass of people higher in the foodchain.

Also, all these app stores on Android/iOS and now WIndows - the image of the 'homebrew developer 'is dying out as well- every app needs to be sold now, everybody feels 'entitled' to making money by 'monetizing' their apps. And you see this spill over into the 'underground console scenes' as well, where scams are made out of 'non-public knowledge' (such as Bludisk, Trueblue).

It's just sickening to see these hacker scenes prostitute themselves out and destroy themselves without them even realizing it. Then again, nobody in this 'PS3 scene' (at least the ones with a public persona) can be even regarded as a real 'scene veteran' - all these guys are the current 'hipster' late twenty something 'would be hackers' that think posting on Twitter and IRC a lot are the main 'rites to passage'.